the fees could be as high as 4%, maybe not that high, we can only hope, don't want another tax. and applies to online shoppers as well. the key you want to hear, debit and prepaid cards are exempt from this. there are questions out there whether american express users will be able to avoid this. they have special language in their contract which means they may be exempt, shep. >> shepard: and these fees are illegal in some states. >> yeah, ten states, you're lucky in you live in california, colorado, connecticut, florida, kansas, maine, massachusetts, new york, oklahoma, and texas. i just want to tell people like the rooeason it's a big deal. look i'll pay cash, what's the big deal. >> shepard: if you have cash on you. >> if you have cash on you, a, and b, credit cards have protections for consumers. if you want to call up after you bought something and falls apart and you don't want to pay for it you call the credit card operator and have it expunged, you can't necessarily do that with cash and get your money back, big protections built in for people who use credit card. i'm no